Senate Select Committee on Presidential Campaign Activiti...

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Location:
488921_1_1
Yes
.Caucus Room, Russell Senate Office Building
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Timecode:
1973  (Actual Year)
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-
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10421
114002
[00.29.42-GURNEY continues to challenge DEAN'S testimony on the subject of raising money to buy the silence of HUNT and other Watergate defendants] Senator GURNEY. Well, as I understand your testimony now, you did discuss this business, of raising the money for bail, for support, for attorneys' fees. Mr. DEAN. That is correct.. Senator GURNEY. And you did -not, discuss specifically that this Money was being raised to pay for silence. Is that correct,?, Mr. DEAN. Well, Senator, I can't recall specifically what I said, but I felt quite confident that Mr. Kalmbach understood, Given the whole procedure that was being set up, and the, use of Mr. Ulasewicz, that this was not for humanitarian purposes, we might say. [00.30.16-KEY flaw in GURNEY'S theory] Senator GURNEY. Who suggested the use of Mr. Ulasewicz? Mr. DEAN. Mr. Kalmbach raised that himself. He said he was the only man he, would trust,. Senator GURNEY. What, did you say and plan or what was the understanding about the instructions that were going to be, given to Mr. Kalmbach from time to time? Mr. DEAN. I told him that Mitchell had suggested that he, get his detailed instructions from Mr. LaRue, who had all the facts and details. I did not have them. Senator GURNEY. You mentioned a, meeting in your office. I don't recall the date now, but Mr. LaRue came there for the purpose, I think, of turning over some money. Is that at correct? Mr. DEAN,. No, it wasn't to turn over money: it was to explain to Mr. Kalmbach the nature of the, deliveries. He had a large, sheet of paper--when I say large, it was probably a folded 8 by 10. Mr. Kalmbach took notes and put, into his own code on a very small piece of paper the information that Mr. LaRue had and put this in his wallet. Senator GURNEY. Did you set up that meeting? Mr. DEAN. As I recall, Mr. Kalmbach had asked me if LaRue and he could meet in my office, and I said fine. Senator GURNEY. You don't recall that you set up the meeting? Mr. DEAN. I don't recall the mechanics of the meeting, Mr. LaRue had a White House, pass. He had been on the White House staff before. I didn't really know him when he was at the White House and didn't know he had a pass until he was able to come into my office without being cleared. Mr. Kalmbach also had a pass, so it was very easy for them to come to my office and meet. Senator GURNEY. Were there any other people present? Mr. DEAN. NO, sir. Senator GURNEY. Just the three of you? Mr. DEAN. That is correct. Senator GURNEY. My understanding of your previous testimony is that at the meeting, you didn't pay any attention to it at all and they just talked among themselves--- Mr. DEAN. Well, I wouldn't say--I -wasn't totally unaware of what they were talking about. I can't recall specifically the totals, the dollar amounts. I did take some telephone calls and return some, because Mr. Kalmbach was being very careful in deciding how he was going to decipher down this larger list into a smaller list that he could use himself. [00.32.34-GURNEY turns to challenging DEAN'S testimony about meetings with NIXON during the coverup period, specifically DEAN'S assertions that NIXON was aware of the COVERUP] Senator GURNEY. Let's turn now to the September 15 meeting with the President and Mr. Haldeman and yourself. That of course is a very important meeting, because, I understand from your testimony that it was at that meeting that you felt that the President knew all about Watergate, is that right? [00.33.07] Mr. DEAN. Well, I will say this, when I came in, the indictments had been announced. He acted as if it 'was a very cordial circumstance. The President asked me to sit, down and told me, that Bob had told him What I had been doing and he expressed appreciation for it. He, you know, indicated that he was--I could tell, you know you can tell, when you are talking- with the President, when he understands or not. I learned that even more later when I had more dealings with him, when I knew something would come up that he knew nothing about and I would have to go into greater detail. Senator GURNEY. Did you discuss the criminal cases that were coming on for trial? -we did or it was the criminal case at that point. Mr. DEAN. Yes, -was the entire seven were being -moved forward as a trial. Senator GURNEY. Did you discuss the civil suits that were filed by the Democrats? Mr. DEAN. Yes, we did. Senator GURNEY. Did you discuss the Common Cause suit that had been filed by -Common Cause? Mr. DEAN. That is correct. Senator GURNEY. Did you discuss the Patman hearings that -were imminent? Mr. DEAN. That is correct, we did. Senator GURNEY. Any idea how long these discussions took? Mr. DEAN. I would say that the entire meeting lasted 30 minutes or some, 40 minutes. [00.34.36]