July 27, 1995 - Part 3
July 27, 1995 - Part 3
(14:10:38) Mr. CHERTOFF. After you and Mr. Margolis returned to the Department, do you know whether that agreement or understanding was reported to the Deputy Attorney General? Mr. ADAMS. I did not speak with the Deputy Attorney General that afternoon. It's my understanding that Mr. Margolis did, and he reported that agreement to Mr. Heymann. Mr. CHERTOFF. Again, to make clear, when we say "agreement," I understand this was not an agreement like a written contract you go to court to enforce. It was a gentleman's handshake agreement; right? Mr. ADAMS. Yes, it was our understanding; that's correct. Mr. CHERTOFF. Now, the next day, did you come back in the morning to carry out this agreement? Mr. ADAMS. Yes, we did. Mr. CHERTOFF. Did you go in the morning to Mr. Nussbaum's office? Mr. ADAMS. Yes, we did, arriving at approximately 10 a.m. Mr. CHERTOFF. What happened? Mr. ADAMS. Mr. Nussbaum an nounced that he had decided to change the procedure for the search or inventory of the office. He said that he alone would look at each document to determine relevance and privilege, and that we would not be doing that. Mr. CHERTOFF. When you say "we would not be doing" it, you mean Mr. ADAMS. Mr. Margolis and myself would not be looking at the documents. Mr. Nussbaum would be doing that himself. Mr. CHERTOFF. What was the reaction that you or Mr. Margolis had to that? Mr. ADAMS. We pointed out that that was completely inconsistent with the agreement of the day before, and we argued with Mr. Nussbaum. We said this was not what we had agreed to, that he was making a mistake, and we were going to have to call our boss, the Deputy Attorney General. Mr. CHERTOFF. What did Mr. Nussbaum say? Mr. ADAMS. I can't recall exactly what Mr. Nussbaum said at that point. Mr. Margolis, in fact, did call Phil Heymann. Mr. CHERTOFF. Tell us what happened then. Mr. ADAMS. I cannot recall whether Mr. Heymann got Mr. Nussbaum on the telephone or not. Either he did that, or he relayed his own opposition to this change in plans through Mr. Margolis. At any rate, the position of Mr. Heymann was communicated to Mr. Nussbaum, that he was making a mistake to make this change in plans. 548 Mr. CHERTOFF. In other words, Mr. Heymann's position was that Mr. Nussbaum was making a mistake in changing this agreement? Mr. ADAMS. That's correct. Mr. CHERTOFF. Now, I want to still focus on these discussions you're having on the morning of the 22nd when Mr. Nussbaum changes the deal here and I want to ask you, first of all, whether you had prepared a document the next week, the week of the 26th, that summarizes your recollections of what happened on this particular day. Mr. ADAMS. Yes, the following week, I did. Mr. CHERTOFF. Do you have a copy of that with you? The CHAIRMAN. I take it the Committee has been furnished a copy of this? Mr. CHERTOFF. Yes. The CHAIRMAN. Mr. Ben-Veniste, we all have copies. Mr. CHERTOFF. Yes, it is F149, and perhaps we could put it up on the Elmo. Mr. ADAMS. I do have a copy, yes. Mr. CHERTOFF. While we're putting this up and getting it focused, I want to ask you why did you prepare this document the next week? Mr. ADAMS. At the time I prepared the document, Mr. Heymann had instructed me to do such a document because he was concerned with various things that had transpired between the Justice Department and the White House, and he instructed me to prepare, essentially, a listing of things that happened Senator KERRY. Could you speak up a little? Mr. ADAMS. He instructed me to prepare a listing of things that we didn't like. Mr. CHERTOFF. He did this because he was concerned about the way things have been handled. Mr. ADAMS. He was concerned about-yes, various events that had transpired. Mr. CHERTOFF. So this document was prepared at the Deputy Attorney General's request the following week. Let me move you down to about the middle of the second paragraph where it says "the next morning," and I'd like to ask you to read that to the end of the paragraph there. Mr. ADAMS. It says: The next morning, however, Mr. Nussbaum had changed his mind and said be would look at the documents and decide privilege issues himself. The Justice Department attorneys pointed out that that was inconsistent with the previous day's agreement and would cause problems. We stated that the Counsel's Office would be better off to allow the Department attorneys to decide or at least help decide privilege issues because that would allow the White House to say that the issue was considered independently, Moreover, we stated that we had been asked to undertake this particular assignment at the White House in part because we had reputations of not talking to the press or 'leaking.' Mr. Nussbaum did not immediately begin the search but waited for about 21/2 hours---during which time be said he was considering whether to allow us to see the documents-before deciding that only he and Associate Counsels Neuwirth and Sloan would see the documents.