Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III United States Senate Caucus Room, Washington DC
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator WEICKER. Now, again to repeat, Mr. Baldwin, recently there have been suggestions that you were a double agent working for the Democrats. I want you to describe to this committee, first of all, any incidents that may have led to such comments being made. Mr. BALDWIN. Well, I believe the No. 1 incident may be the fact that I was not a defendant in the criminal action that preceded this incident. There have also been incidents in the paper that Mrs. Mitchell has attributed to the fact that I had stated to her on different occasions that I was a Democrat. I do have Democratic friends, I wouldn t deny that. [Laughter.] But I have been a registered Republican since I have been old enough to vote, so I do not know if that makes any difference. And at the time of the trial, the criminal trial I am speaking of, of the defendants, during the course of the days that we were roomed at the United States Attorney's Office, the conversation was initiated on several occasions by one or two of the detectives that the only way I could have gotten away was the fact I was a double agent. There was some kidding back and forth amongst police officers. And that, to the best of my knowledge, is the only indication that I have of, other than the fact that I heard statements made by different individuals that I was a double agent, on television and it the newspaper.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator WEICKER. Was there not one additional incident which actually came to the attention of Mr. McCord? Mr. BALDWIN [conferring with his attorney]. I believe, Senator are you referring to during the course of my employment in Washington where I had a date with an individual young lady that happened to work for the Democratic - for an official of the Democratic Party? Senator WEICKER. Yes. Mr. BALDWIN. I do not believe that would have led Mr. McCord to believe I was a double agent. As a matter of fact, he wanted me to exploit that and obtain all the information I could obtain from her. [Laughter.] And I kind of refused to go along with that. Senator WEICKER. Just so your entire story is on the record, Mr Baldwin. It is true that you were with a lady who was in the employ of the Democratic Party. Is that correct? Mr. BALDWIN. Well, she was in the employment of an attorney who had an affliation with a Democratic Party organization in the Washington DC area. I don t mean to imply that he was an official working at the Democratic National Committee offices. He had a law office in the Washington DC area and she worked for him. She was going to the convention for the Democratic National Convention in Miami. She told me that and we thought we might see each other down there.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator WEICKER. In other words, these are the only three incidents that you can bring to mind that might have given rise to any speculation, as to your being a double agent in this matter. Is that correct? Mr. BALDWIN. That is correct. Senator WEICKER. Now would you please state to the committee your own feelings on this matter. Have you received at any time any payment or promise - any promise of payment, any income from anyone associated with the Democratic party? Mr. BALDWIN. Absolutely not. As a matter of fact, I have three weeks of pay for the Republican Committee that I haven t been paid for either.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator WEICKER. And lastly, Mr Baldwin, would you just give the committee a very brief description of your professional background prior to being employed by the Committee to Re-Elect the President. Specifically, did you work for the Federal Bureau of Investigation? Mr. BALDWIN. That is correct. I graduated from the Fairfield University in 1957. I entered the U.S. Marine Corps. I was a member of the Marine Corps Reserve with the rank of captain. I am no longer a member of the Reserve. I then entered law school in 1960. Upon graduation from law school I entered the Federal Bureau of Investigation as a special agent. I resigned from the Federal Bureau of Investigation. I worked for the circuit court system in the State of Connecticut and, at the same time, I was also an instructor in police science at a local university.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator WEICKER. You testified here today that you took an active role in what you must have known were illegal phone taps or breaking in and, as you have just stated, you are a former FBI agent, graduate of a law school, employee of various law enforcement agencies, and my final question is: Why did you, with this type of background, take part in such activities? Mr. BALDWIN. Well, with this background, Senator, I have been in organizations where I have always taken orders. I did not question the legality of the operation because of several factors. I had come down from Connecticut to work for the Committee To Re-Elect the President, and that was the President's organization, as far as I was concerned. Mr. Mitchell was heading the organization. Every individual that I was introduced to or that was pointed out to me I was advised "This is a White House consultant, this is a White House aide, they are on loan. As soon as the election is over in November they go back to the White House, Al, if we do a good job here." My sole goal was to obtain permanent employment. And Mr. McCord had been, I knew that he was, an ex-FBI agent, that he had been in the CIA and, based on the credentials of all these people I did not question - possibly that was a wrong assumption on my part, not to have questioned, but I didn t - the legality. I ve been asked if it entered my mind whether I thought it was illegal. I realize that there are wiretaps that are illegal but I also realize that under certain conditions such a wiretap can be ordered or authorized by specific individuals. And I felt that I was in no position to question John Mitchell or anyone else under his command, including Mr. McCord. Senator WEICKER. But it is also true, Mr. Baldwin, you never received any direct order from Mr. John Mitchell relative to that phone tap? Mr. BALDWIN. Other than reference to Mr. Mitchell if I obtained if I was involved in any difficulty establishing my authority for being in a certain place or the fact of the weapon I was to mention John Mitchell.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator WEICKER. With the exception, with the exception of the time when you took a trip to Chicago, Detroit, and Westchester County with Mrs. Mitchell, you received all your orders from Mr. McCord, isn't that correct? Mr. BALDWIN. That is correct. Senator WEICKER. Now, just to finish up on the time sequence, you left the Howard Johnson on the morning, early morning of the 17th of June, is that correct? Mr. BALDWIN. That is correct. Senator WEICKER. And where did you go to from the Howard Johnson? Mr. BALDWIN. I proceeded to Connecticut. Senator WEICKER. Did you first go to the McCord home? Mr. BALDWIN. Oh, I assumed, Senator, you had covered the fact that I had delivered the items of equipment to Mr. McCord's home. Mrs. McCord drove me back to Washington. I then took my own personal car and returned to Connecticut. Senator WEICKER. All right. Mr. Chairman, this is all the questioning I have for Mr. Baldwin. There are events of which counsel knows that transpired after Mr. Baldwin's arrival in Connecticut which is something that the committee should go into further. I have no further questions.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator ERVIN. Did you ask Mr. Baldwin about what he did with the information he got from the wiretap? Senator WEICKER. Mr. Chairman, I could have possibly missed such a question, I will ask him again in any event. To whom did you gave this information, the information on the wiretaps? Mr. BALDWIN. Other than the time I delivered it to the Committee To Re-Elect the President, I gave it to James McCord at all times. The onionskins were still in his briefcase the night I locked his briefcase. Some of them, I can't specify that every single copy of the logs were in his briefcase, but the night I delivered the logs to his home, copies of quite a few of the conversations were in his briefcase. Senator WEICKER. It is your testimony then that you gave these items to Mr. McCord with the exception of one time when you delivered them to the Committee To Re-Elect the President? Mr. BALDWIN. That is correct. Senator WEICKER. Whom did you give them to on that occasion? Mr. BALDWIN. I left them with a guard that was in the lobby. I arrived after 6 o'clock and the guard was stationed in the lobby, the offices had been closed.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator ERVIN. I don't know whether it was brought out in what form he put them in. How did you take the information which you gave to Mr. McCord with the exception of that one occasion - what form was it in? Mr. BALDWIN. I am sorry, Senator, do you mean the actual way of transcribing? Senator ERVIN. The information you got while you were at the Howard Johnson from the Democratic headquarters, what form was it in when you gave it to Mr. McCord? Mr. BALDWIN. The initial day, the first day that I recorded the conversations was on a yellow sheet. On Memorial Day, I believe it is Memorial Day, on the holiday of May, I believe it was, 28th when he returned to the room he brought an electric typewriter, he instructed me in the upper right-hand corner to print, or by typewriter, the unit, the date, the page and then proceed down into the body and in chronological order put the time and then the contents of the conversation. In my error, as unit I used, the exact frequency that we were monitoring and after about 2 days Mr. McCord came back and said change that, anybody reading these things is going to know the frequency.
Watergate Hearings: Senate Select Committee Hearings on Presidential Campaign Activities, May 24, 1973 - Testimony of Alfred C. Baldwin III
Senator ERVIN. And you typed a summary of the conversations you overheard? Mr. BALDWIN. Well, they weren't exactly a summary, I would say almost verbatim, Senator. Senator ERVIN. Almost verbatim. And the names of the people who, as far as you could identify them, were using the phones? Mr. BALDWIN. Well that is correct. Initially, it was very hard to establish names for maybe the first day or two. But subsequent to that - you see the problem was I had never worked one of the units before and after Mr. McCord instructed me on how to operate it, I could tune it so that the minute the call was either going out or coming in I would then be in on the beginning - but prior to that I would receive a little indication on the scope and I would be into the conversation so I would not know who they asked for or who was calling. But eventually, that was correct. Senator ERVIN. Then you gave all the typewritten transcriptions of what you heard to Mr. McCord except on one occasion you mentioned? Mr. BALDWIN. That is correct, Senator. Senator ERVIN. You did not keep any carbon copies? Mr. BALDWIN. No. Mr. McCord had the onionskins and they were still in his briefcase the night I locked it.